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Looking for some AR advice and help!

Meng Aug 20, 2011

  1. Meng

    Meng Huge member

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    Hey, alright to start off I have been looking to get an AR for a while. I know quiet a bit about handguns, but I am newish to the AR's, and I am a bit overwhelmed. Seems like there are way more places, companies, and options.

    So I figured why not reach out to our awesome JD family.

    I have been reading alot about AR's and reading reviews, and been to the range, also watched alot of youtube vids about them lol. I would love an AR for the home, and something that would do well in a beginner to intermediate competition scene, like 3 gun.
    I have set aside a bit of change, but I would really like to try to find 1 rifle that can nicely fill both rolls.

    I havnt shot to many, I have had range time with a standard bushy, and also an XCR.

    I've been a fan of HK 416's for quite a while so I was pretty excited that the MR556a1(and 762) finally came out. They are quite pricey, so I have a hard time wanting to go with that as my option right this second when I have a limited amount of funds to devote, when I could get a fantastic rifle and a site for it and an upgrade or two for the same price.
    I have heard great things about them though.

    Another one that has been recommended to me quite a rew times is LWRC. I was parusing there site and the M6A3 looked quite nice a nice mix. I talked to a couple guys that said that it was a good multipurpose rifle that can do well at target comps, as well as other things.

    I also checked out some Stag rifles. I am a lefty and so I was definatly interested in there left hand rifles. Although I have read some mixed reviews about some Stag rifles and I have been trained and I am used to shooting a right handed rifle left handed.

    Anyways sorry to go on and on, I wasnt planning on this being so long.

    If anyone has any advice, info, recommendations, or even a place or direction to point me that would be greatly appriciated!

    Thanks!
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Aug 20, 2011
  2. bkpetty

    bkpetty Huge member

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    Hey brother, you asked a great question... but there's no good answer (in my opinion). I shoot my old Colt A2, at CMP matches, and it shoots as good as just about any other.(I've owned it since 1983) I have buddy's who have RR, and Bushmasters, a Remington, as well as one who built his own with various parts. I believe ANY quality AR will serve you well, and be a helluva lot of fun for YEARS... (my daughters both LOVE to shoot the "black rifle") since parts are interchangeable, any that you wear out can be replaced, with very little fitting required. and you can customize them all to HELL:yuna: LOTS of FUN... (throw a "broken shell extractor" in your range bag, just in case...)
    Hey, sorry I'm not much help, but let us know what you end up buying. :ross:
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Aug 20, 2011
  3. stdlrf11

    stdlrf11 A Most Impressive Member Super Moderator Brigade Member

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    I'm a big fan of buying a complete gun. I don't trust franken-guns.

    I'm an armorer for 7 Colt rifles. I've owned an Olympic and been to classes with students owning several other brands of rifles. In every class and every training exercise, someone's rifle breaks, whether its an extractor, charging handle or whatever. I can say that in the 5 years I've been taking care of these guns, nothing on those 7 Colts has broken yet. From what I've seen and what I've heard, Colt has the best QC in the business.

    If I ever buy another AR-15, its going to be a Colt.
     
  4. Sheldon_Wickersham

    Sheldon_Wickersham Blue Star Knives Knife Maker or Craftsman

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    From personal experience, I've had zero problems to date with both Colt and Bushmaster, and my little Olympic Arms CAR-15 made in 1993 has run three gun matches flawlessly to date. As always, YMMV :jdwink2:
     
  5. Badger01

    Badger01 Average member

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    First to the OP you are a smart man for doing your research first before you buy. And you have already done more than most which is think about what you are going to use the rifle for. A couple more questions you need to ask.

    "How Many rounds a month/ year do you suppose you will Shoot?"
    if you plan on shooting 1,000rds a year, oly, stag and bush will be fine.

    "Do you plan on running it in training classes?"

    "Will you ever hit the woods with this gun? As in will you ever carry it farther than the safe- car -range - car- safe.

    And some other things. DO NOT GET CAUGHT UP IN THE "PISTON" GAME. I promise you that HK And LWRC does not offer anything that WELL BUILT DI guns will not offer and more. Remember that a gun is like any other tool. It has to be maintained. Even Piston guns come with there own set of problems. And everybody who has been around them knows. This is where I would start lookin. If you want the BEST AR for your money and a complete rifle start with Daniel defense. All their parts and assembly methods are properly Spec'd. I you want something a little more cadillac, Check into Knights Armament (SR-15) Or Noveske. Or Colt. All these will serve you well.

    I am gonna call a Little BS on the comment of "I dont trust Franken Guns" Well franken guns are what ALL of our armed forces use and yet they carry them into battle everyday. The AR by design is somewhat of a franken gun. IT WILL BE VERY RELIABLE IF ASSEMBLED AND MAINTAINED CORRECTLY! My personal carbine that I am running has see 12,230 rounds already this year. The lower is Knights Armament, upper is BCM, Noveske barrel, and other MISC parts but all are built to spec and assembled properly. I clean my guns and shoot good ammo, i have exactly 12 malfuntions, 5 were mag related all others except 1 were ammo related, with one double feed. Hey folks with only 1 double feed in 12,000 rds. awesome. Sorry for the long answer but it was a complicated question.
     
  6. 50calmike

    50calmike 50 caliber Devil

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    I have an Eagle Arms lower with Rock River trigger group and a DPMS CMP upper. It's much more accurate than I am and has had some small issues with worn out parts.
    I have had more issues with my bolt guns to tell the truth. Of course, nearly all my bolt guns have seen at least one war.
     
  7. stdlrf11

    stdlrf11 A Most Impressive Member Super Moderator Brigade Member

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    I should clarify something. By franken gun, I mean people who buy stripped lowers, parts kits, bolts and upper receivers and try to piece together a gun as cheaply as possible. Most people I've seen do this have no armorer experience and treat the gun as a big Lego project. They usually do this to save a few bucks but they generally end up as huge headaches. At least what I've seen.

    You are right. A properly assembled and maintained weapon will work just fine. I just don't trust other people's Lego projects, aka franken guns.

    One thing though, could you please clarify this statement?

    I've never heard this before and I'd like to hear your input on the subject.
     
  8. Meng

    Meng Huge member

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    Thanks so much for the input and info!

    Badger, good questions. I had not thought about anything besides range and home.
    I would like to do some training classes. Also I would like to not be worried about taking it into the woods/wilderness, although I dont have any plans to take it into the woods unless there is a 3gun comp or some shooting event outside.

    Also thanks for reminding me. Yes I have checked out DD, I like them very much, and have herd great things. The hard part is I can find HK and LWRC's I havent been able t find DD in stock anywhere. I guess thats a good thing.

    Also as for Piston, vs DI, I dont really care, It jut happens that I like/have been recommened HK/LWRC and they run pistons.

    I shall defintly check out some Colts, that is one that I have not looked into past some
    pistols.

    Hope everyone is having a nice Sunday!

    Ps ya I am looking for a complete rifle.
    I love techning and tinkering, but I dont want to do that with something I am not very familiar with, specially it being my first AR.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Aug 22, 2011
  9. Sheldon_Wickersham

    Sheldon_Wickersham Blue Star Knives Knife Maker or Craftsman

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    My local gun club is having the last 'Hi-Power Sporting Rifle' match of the season on 9/3 - 32 rounds in two four string groups at 100 meters from prone, standing, sitting, and kneeling.

    Any centerfire rifle that holds at least four rounds, and any optic or sight - no compensators, muzzle breaks, or bipods. A lot of hunting and older military bolt-action rifles show up, along with AR's, Garands, and M1A's

    I put in my five hour RSO shift today, and shot my way though most of it. I shot a few hundred rounds through my 32 yr old 10/22, getting used to the new Hogue overmold stock with longer LOP and new Leapers fixed 4x optic (those Aguila sub-sonic lead HP's group 1/2 MOA at 50 meters in five shot strings All-Day-Long!), and...

    Another 100 rounds in two round 'draw and fire' speed drills at 15 feet through my carry Glock 19, and 80 rnds through the new KelTec PF9 (no problems noted, although my trigger finger-tip is a little sore) - and two hundred rounds of mixed Herter's 55 gr. (Tula, Russian), PMC 55 gr., and HSM (Hunting Shack, Montana) SS109 62 gr. through a early 1990's Colt Sporter H-Bar 1/7 twist using Knight's Armament 30 rnd mags.

    No failures noted with the Colt using any of the rounds mentioned above. Best 100 meter four round group was slightly over quarter sized, in the bullseye, fired prone with an early 70's Colt 3 x 20 scope and the PMC ammo. Truth in advertising here - the rifle was already sighted in, but I dialed it in using a Harris bipod and spotting scope prior to pulling the bipod off.

    The Colt's really work for casual plinking, IMO.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Aug 22, 2011
  10. Badger01

    Badger01 Average member

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    STDLRF11 I should have been a little more clear when I called BS. After reading your post I understand what you are saying about Franken guns, and most guys start just throwing random parts together trying to cut corners. You are 100% correct MOST people delve into the ar system without doing homework and create a logistical monster. As per my comment about our armed forces using franken guns.....Soldiers and marines draw weapons from the armories that are mixed and matched parts. In most cases if a carrier key works loose after thousands of rounds the armorers will just drop in a whole new BCG. But after years of service, you have weapons that have lots of parts that are not original to that particular rifle. However they all run because the parts are built to the same specifications as the original parts of said rifle. But you know this as it seems you do this kind of work. I should not have called BS. just expounded upon what we both seem to know.
     
  11. Badger01

    Badger01 Average member

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    To the OP. The reason why I mentioned carrying the gun in the woods and what not is because if you are like me and go for long walkabouts then weight can be an issue to some. there are great options out there right now for weapons with lightweight barrels. and lightweight rails lights... so on and so forth. Just consider weight.

    Also the reason I brought up training classes which i highly suggest, then your weapon will most likely see high round counts, in a short amount of time, and thus a harder use of the gun overall, not to mention things like banging it around and what not. If you plan to do this then I HIGHLY suggest putting back a few pennies extra and buying a good gun from the get go. STDlrf11 had it right when he pointed you toward colt. He was also right about their QC. And you are right DD's are hard to come by (thats what she said). But reguardless of the particular brand you choose, you ahve the right idea by buying quality the 1st time.
     
  12. siriusaudio

    siriusaudio THE SERIOUS™

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    I'll keep this short so as not to piss someone off...


    A lot of people in the know praise Bravo Company Ar's as some of the best out there, and they are reasonably priced.

    Also, if you want to go piston for whatever reason, most of the things I have heard lately say that the Barret REC7 is the piston AR to beat.
     
  13. Remy

    Remy knifemaker Knife Maker or Craftsman

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    Take a look at Spikes as well as the other brands mentioned. I love my S&W as well, but like most of the "standard" brand guns you only come out ahead if you find a model that's exactly what you want. The minute you start changing out parts you are better off having gone to one of the brands that will let you customize from the company.

    I'll put in a big plug for a LaRue if you want serious accuracy and quality.
    Bravo Company as a source for an upper or even a complete rifle is also worth checking into. I often suggest folks look at ordering a lower from Spikes exactly how they want it, then an upper from BCM. Technically it's not a "complete" rifle, but both halves are professionally assembled from high grade parts.

    As for Stag, they make good rifles, but they've basically designed themselves out of the "cool" category in the AR popularity contest. They make good quality and good performing rifles, just without following the monthly trends. :ross:
     
  14. Long Rifle

    Long Rifle Huge member

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    I put a Bravo Company upper on my Stag lower and have not looked back since! Bravo makes great ARs!
     
    englishmark likes this.
  15. rscheppmann

    rscheppmann Diabolus ex Occasus Knife Maker or Craftsman

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    From my personal experience with different brands of ARs, nothing has been as reliable as my Colt LEC... 1000s of rounds, numerous Instructor and Operator courses, and this thing just keeps going... I know that you mentioned the HK 416; try it out side-by-side with a gas tube cycled gun. It might be me, but I notice increased felt recoil with the piston driven guns. If Eugene Stoner wanted a piston driven firing system, I think he would have put one in his original design. I don't shoot matches, but I do Shoot... A LOT! I recently began shooting an LMT, and they seem to be right on par also (could be because Colt makes a lot of their parts:bwah:). Take care, and happy hunting.
     
  16. Meng

    Meng Huge member

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    Thanks for all the info.
    Lol I almost feel further from a choice, so many good looking ARs out there.

    I shall check spikes and bravo and I did check the REC7 seems really good.

    Has any checked out or tried POF ARs?
     
  17. Glover

    Glover Huge member

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    You will not be disappointed with a Stag Model 2L. The Price is Right.

    Like all the boys here say, if there is something about it you aren't happy with (cheap grip). Replace it. There are tons of lil things you can do to make it "Your" GUN. Love mine.
     
  18. cpd670

    cpd670 Average member

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    I am a big believer in buy once cry one.
    Define the type of rifle that will best fit your needs.
    Three gun match rifles are not going to be the same as a light weight sporter.

    For me DI guns are perfect, the only advantage I can see in a piston is if you are running a suppressor, which I don't.
    LaRue and Noveske are arguably the most accurate production rifles going, but at $2K they charge for that accuracy.

    In the basic M4 configuration any quality manufacture will work. Smith & Wesson, Bushmaster, Stag, ect.

    I'm not afraid to build my own, although you will never recover the investment if you ever had to sell it. ARs are not very difficult to assemble with the proper tools and knowledge. By making your own you can save a bunch of money just by not having to buy a complete rifle and then swapping out parts to create the rifle you want.
     

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